After breaking 1000 comments on the previous thread, I felt it was a good time to start another.
As a reminder, here are some of the most recent outstanding questions for Kathy:
From Laurie:
You said you answered my questions, and wish more questions were asked. Here are some questions that were not addressed.
Matt 23:8 read first
Philemon 1:10
1 Corinthians 4:14-17
1 Corinthians 12:27
2 Timothy 1:11
1 Timothy 2:7
Ephesians 4:11,12Why is it that messiah says not to be called rabbi or father, but Paul it’s not obedient to this command?
Matt 10:7,8
1 Timothy 5:17,18
1 Corinthians 9:11,12Messiah says here that he had given freely, go and freely give. Again, Paul is disobedient.
Matt 18:15
Galatians 2:11-14
Messiah said that if you have a problem with your brother, you should deal with it privately. Here Paul lashes out at Peter “before them all”.
Matt 9:10-12
2 Thessalonians 3:6,7
Yahusha said in the passage above that he came to call the sinner to repentance, not the righteous. Why would Paul want to separate from those that actually need him?
From William:
the “evidences” you listed arent real evidences. And since you refuse to look at things that are counter to your current beliefs, how can you honestly speak to me about evidences?
here’s all I’ve seen you provide:
1) martyrs, even though every religion and many non-religions have them.
2) our very existence – which no one knows how that started, but even if you must land on god(s), you must go back to that book of claims to get to jesus.
3) there were miracles, but as it turns out, those dont happen today, and end up being more claims by the same men who claim they speak for god.
4) the fulfilled prophecies we’ve discussed weren’t really prophecies at all, or had to be viewed so figuratively that it’s difficult to show anything precise about them other than location (maybe) in order to claim they’re actually fulfilled.
5) 40 authors taking 1500 years to write the bible. But there’s nothing miraculous about men writing books, editing books, and being inspired to write a book or letter after reading an older book.
In addition to these, I’d like to ask something of both Kathy and Laurie (Matt or Hayden or portal001 (Ryan) can chime in as well):
The Bible defines God as being all-loving, all-merciful, fair, just, etc. It can also be read as promising an eternity in Hell for those who don’t serve him correctly. As a believer, how do you square those two statements?
Finding Truth 
crickets
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…the only two states I’ve ever lived in are Florida and Alabama. Both have their baggage…
The Peach State isn’t any better. 😕
Kathy is in her mid to late forties. could be 50 now.
her daughter had gotten married a few years back.
not sure of her age. but she is 16yrs younger than Kathy.
At first I thought she seemed my age or older but then I got the impression from other things she said her daughter was still a child.
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To Arch and Ruth,
I appreciate you both feeling sorry for me.. but don’t.. I’m fine.
As for the “hypocrisy”.. there actually isn’t any. I was on FS for a year back in 2012.. (election year).. when it was really easy to get approved and you weren’t required to reapply every 3 months.. that “mysteriously” changed after Obama was re-elected, you now have to reapply every 3 months and it’s harder to get approved for anything over $18.. before it was $200 easy and again with no requirement to reapply for a year.. they didn’t even ask for ANY verification when I applied. And, also, they kept sending me letters letting me know I could also get a phone and service for free.. they were practically begging me.
This is where a lot of your tax money goes.. I’m glad I did this just so I could “testify” to this reality. The left BUYS their votes… they have to.. they’d lose every election otherwise.
The best part about getting food stamps? Seeing how furious “Thesmartestmonkey” (yes he actually picked that name) and other liberals got on Steven Weber’s blog when I told them Obama would NOT be getting my vote.. TSM just couldn’t get over it.. it was hilarious.. for months he kept bringing it up.. accusing me of being a hypocrite.
I’m not being hypocritical in any way for using the assistance I needed and was entitled to under the same rules as everyone else. But I STILL am against the liberal policies that make getting FS so easy and the very policies that destroy jobs instead of creating them.. if Romney had been elected I am 100% certain I would have never needed to apply for FS assistance.
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“dont blame us if we do still have sympathy”
I’d like to think we have as much, if not more empathy than most Christians who were mandated to love their enemy. One can easily see that no one can store up as much vitriol as Kathy without having experienced a lot of pain herself.
I’m of the philosophy that you shouldn’t judge a person until you’ve walked a mile in their shoes – then you’re a mile away and you’ve got their shoes!
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“Ah, arch…I know the hypocrisy is what fried your backside.”
I felt, and feel, no embarrassment about having taken the money – we needed it, and that’s what those programs are there for, people in need. But neither did I backstab the politicians who made it available for us.
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Arch, what you say about me is “vitriol”.. what I say about you all (liberals) is the truth. You all are guilty of every claim I make. It’s always backed up right in the exchange.. something your accusations NEVER come with. I’m honestly trying to be constructive… a problem must be identified before it can be fixed. I may have gotten carried away a few times.. but that was in response to your attitude Arch.. which btw, you had me laughing out loud when you suggested I change “my” attitude.
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““Ah, arch…I know the hypocrisy is what fried your backside.”
I felt, and feel, no embarrassment about having taken the money – we needed it, and that’s what those programs are there for, people in need. But neither did I backstab the politicians who made it available for us.”
Those politicians CREATED the need in the 1st place. The right would never do away with food stamps.. we just understand that the program MUST be run correctly AND jobs MUST be created, not squashed.. the dem’s way leads us straight to bankruptcy.. and then guess what? NO ONE gets help.. nada nothing.. because there will be NO MONEY.
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“…when the duck quacks 9…”
Speaking of ducks – and you were – a guy walks into a bar with a duck on his head. The bartender says, “What can I do for you guys?” The duck says, “I don’t know about him, but can you get this guy off my ass?”
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“she never bothered to thank me!”
(Sigh) No gratitude —
“on a positive note, Kathy’s daughter is a liberal.”
How old could she be, six or so?
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“Arch got the impression that she was quite young — maybe early or mid-twenties?”
Someone said her daughter was six – someone else said she dropped out of school when she got pregnant, if both are true, that would make her 22/23.
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“I am going to have to be the bigger man and step out. she’s going to say I ran”
Well you could always lurk, and if she pops up to counter your claims, reenter our orbit. You’ve probably got one more good rant left before you get kicked off — 🙂
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Do us both a favor, Kathy – check out the per capita income of the country’s Red (conservative) states, vs the country’s Blue (liberal) states, and tell me which has the higher income —
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“a problem must be identified before it can be fixed”
And the sooner you seek out a good therapist, the sooner that issue can be addressed.
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@Laurie,
I’m very interested in what you mean by “keep the commandments”. How do you keep the commandments any differently than Paul? Are you more Jewish than Paul was?
You pointed out that the author of Acts repeated Paul’s conversion story 3 times and slightly alters it each time. I’m well aware of this. The problem for you is that if you use this as a reason to reject Paul, you will have to reject the four gospels because they have similar alterations. This is especially pronounced in the passion narratives, and I’m sure every atheist on the blogosphere has a post about it. The point is, if you reject Paul on grounds of these alterations and want a coherent worldview, you will have to reject the four gospels as well. Then you lose the Messiah.
Let’s talk about apostleship. You’re view of apostleship is far too rigid. “Apostle” is a Greek word for a messenger who is sent forth. Of course it can have a more specific connotation. The 12 apostles were chosen because they symbolize the 12 tribes of Israel. But, they were not the only apostles of Jesus, they were just the ones that symbolized the 12 tribes. Other apostles who were not of the 12 included:
***Paul (Acts 14:14)
***Barnabas (Acts 14:14)
***James, the brother of Jesus (Galatians 1:19)
***Andronicus (Romans 16:7)
***Junias, the only known female apostle (Romans 16:7)
***Jesus himself was considered an apostle of God (Hebrews 3:1)
How did these people become apostles of Jesus if they were not the 12? Well, to be an apostle Jesus had to appear to you and send you forth to proclaim the gospel and apparently this happened to Paul (Acts 26:15-18, 1 Cor 15:8, 1 Cor 1:17) and many other people just judging by the pre-Pauline Creed in 1 Corinthians 15. You asked, “Who was the apostle to the Gentiles, Peter or Paul?” This is a flawed question because there can easily be more than one. They might have both been. But, we know Paul did more mission work in Gentile territory and even spoke and wrote in Greek, whereas we are unsure about Peter.
Paul’s position on eating meat sacrificed to idols is not straight forward. There are different situations here. The overt situation is going to a pagan temple and participating, and Paul is obviously against this just as the authors of Acts and Revelation. The more complicated situation is the meat markets because the meat may or may not have been sacrificed to an idol. Paul says in this situation don’t worry about it, it actually belongs to God. But, if it was ever uncovered that the meat on the table was sacrificed to an idol Paul says to abstain. His reasoning is that it is for the sake of the other for them to realize who you worship. It’s an other-centered policy built out of love, and there is no evidence that Paul’s policy contradicts Acts or Revelation because they are silent on meat markets.
I’m baffled that you count Acts as scripture considering how pro-Paul it is. And, at this point I’m convinced that the only reasonable way to reject Paul is on doctrinal grounds. You would need to find a Pauline doctrine that logically contradicts a doctrine from Jesus. Notice this cannot just be an additional doctrine. It must be a logical contradiction.
-B
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“The point is, if you reject Paul on grounds of these alterations and want a coherent worldview, you will have to reject the four gospels as well. Then you lose the Messiah.“- What a novel idea —
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Those politicians CREATED the need in the 1st place. The right would never do away with food stamps.. we just understand that the program MUST be run correctly AND jobs MUST be created, not squashed.. the dem’s way leads us straight to bankruptcy.. and then guess what? NO ONE gets help.. nada nothing.. because there will be NO MONEY.
Kathy,
None of us are really on this earth for that long considering the span of human history. Its a big beautiful world out there, so many possible topics and interactions . Talking about food stamps is not on the top of my list.
Why not step outside today? Stop and take a deep breath of air, enjoy the weather, and ponder the strangeness that were all floating on this big globe together.
I’m going to do the same.
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or if not today, why not make it tonight? outside your verandah or front yard. Forgot its prob night-time where you are 🙂
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“…ponder the strangeness that were all floating on this big globe together”
And while you’re about it, ponder that massive electromagnetic blast earth just received this evening from a solar flare.
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Good night Kathy, have a good one, take it easy 🙂
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@The “BIRD”
You poor bastard. You struggle to raise that girl right. Even get food stamps to make sure she eats as best she can. Try to raise her with some integrity and how does she repay you? By marrying a RED-NECK! “shakes head in shame AND pity.”
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@Everyone
Ryan cannot be the nicest guy on the internet. What kind of a person is named “Ryan” but goes by “Portal001?” What the hell does that even mean!?
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@William the Conqueror!
WtC, how am I supposed to refer to you as WtC when you are acting all nicey nice all of a sudden. Cut it out. Get some immaturity for God’s sake.
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@Nate
“Any time someone has suggested a book for me to read, I read it.” Try Moby Dick… It sucks.
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@This time with feeling… Kathy
So kid, you got any evidence other than martyrs? I mean, I talk to the Old Man every day, So that’s mine. These guys don’t like that answer but then my relationship with him isn’t dependent on their belief. What do you have?
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Hayden,
Portal is a reference to the game franchise by Valve
I love its concept, so I used it as my tag
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🙂
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@arch,
I felt, and feel, no embarrassment about having taken the money – we needed it, and that’s what those programs are there for, people in need. But neither did I backstab the politicians who made it available for us.
That would be because there is no embarrassment to be felt. That’s exactly what these programs are designed for.
@Kathy,
I’m confused. By your description of the account of your food stamp use I’m not certain if you really needed the food stamps or if you were just abusing the system. If you really needed the assistance it would seem you might be a little more grateful that it was there for you to utilize rather than scornful over how easy it was to get. I’m well aware that there are people who take advantage of the system but that doesn’t diminish it’s usefulness. Do you even know what the dems views on public assistance programs are, or do you just spout the right wing propaganda you’ve been fed? Further I’m confused because you complain that the system must be run correctly and also seem to be complaining because reforms were made that made it more difficult for you to get the assistance. These are your words:
I was on FS for a year back in 2012.. (election year).. when it was really easy to get approved and you weren’t required to reapply every 3 months.. that “mysteriously” changed after Obama was re-elected, you now have to reapply every 3 months and it’s harder to get approved for anything over $18..
So as long as it was easy to get and you didn’t have to “qualify” your need you took advantage, but when you actually had to “qualify” for the program you didn’t really meet the criteria? I’m just trying to understand what you did there. Because this really does smack of hypocrisy.
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Thanks, William. That’s a lot to read.
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“You poor bastard. You struggle to raise that girl right. Even get food stamps to make sure she eats as best she can. Try to raise her with some integrity and how does she repay you? By marrying a RED-NECK! “shakes head in shame AND pity.’”
As if marrying a Red-neck Neanderthal weren’t bad enough, turns out she’s a CHRISTIAN – the white sheep of the family! Where did I go wrong?
On the bright side, my son, who lives in another state and whom I rarely see except on Skype, and who has for years pretended to be religious for the sake of his Catholic wife (who is beginning to catch on), told me a story about my grandson, as they were driving home from B-ball practice the other day. The boy, after sitting for a time in deep thought, said, “Dad, you know how you told me that when I grow up, I can choose what religion I want to be? Well, I think I want to be an atheist.” Win a few, lose a few!
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