“I ask questions and hope for answers.. silly me.” – translate that, “I ask questions and hope for answers, get them, but refuse to accept them because they don’t agree with what I want to hear.. silly me.” Indeed.
jasonshaw – thanks for the blast-from-the-past video! We always wondered what happened to Uncle Fred – he just went out one day for a pack of smokes, and we never saw him again. After 150 million years, we had almost given up hope.
KC, I’m half-way through God’s Debris. Fascinating! The old man makes some really good points. I would suggest that Kathy read it, but I’m afraid she wouldn’t understand the concept. What do you think?
A guy goes to a psychiatrist for an evaluation. The psychiatrist shows him a series of ink blot tests.
Psychiatrist: “What does this picture remind you of?”
Guy: “Sex!”
Psychiatrist: “And this one?”
Guy: “Sex!”
Psychiatrist:: “And THIS one?”
Guy: “Sex!”
Psychiatrist: “Sir, it seems to me that you are obsessed with sex.”
Guy: ME?! – YOU’RE the one with all the dirty pictures!
Sometimes we see what we want to see, and in some cases, refuse to accept that it could ever be otherwise.
Kathy admits that she knows little to nothing about electronics. Electronics has been my entire career in one form or another. Yet when I tried to explain to her how these things she brought up had a natural explanation she said my answers weren’t good enough. Translation = your answers are not what I wanted to hear or was looking for.
Most of the answers WE collectively have given to her fall into the same category . They are not what she wanted to hear or was looking for.
The funny part was when she said, ““Naturally, I wanted to believe that it was one or both of my parents. But, after talking to people more knowledgeable than me about Christianity and the Bible, I was told that it wasn’t them, but demonic spirits wanting to deceive me into believing it was them.”
Translation = I wanted to be one Supernatural Explanation but after talking to more knowledgeable Christians , I decided to believe in another Supernatural Explanation. 🙂
Debate and dialogue can be helpful in finding truth, but connecting legitimate evidence tends to be far more effective. Like how it was discovered that the Earth revolves around the Sun. Oh right, Christianity wasn’t receptive to that truth either as it was at odds with Genesis.
Pretty sure in that case, debate actually prevented understanding of that truth. That tends to be a common trend with Christianity. Just like your hesitance to accept evolution without a full observation of it, which we now have.
Nan, glad you are enjoying the read. I doubt that Kathy would entertain reading the book . The Old Man gives a great explanation of why people are religious and I think he is equally on track why skeptics are skeptics.
Yes, I know KC – I’ve read everything so far on this latest entry. I tried a computer-free day, but withdrawal symptoms drew me back.
I wonder if Kathy can show me, in the OT, where demons are mentioned before 300 BCE. I ask, because that was the approximate date when Alexander the Great conquered the Levant. To the best of my knowledge, it was the influx of Greek culture that first introduced the Greek concept of daemons.
Of course you have a point that the name of the blog indicates dialog is expected. We’ve all had this discussion multiple times, with multiple people over the years. What is the purpose, I wonder? If you think we should ask ourselves that very question, don’t worry. I am asking myself that right now.
If you actually wanted answers you could have found them here.
Their absence before that time period would be a good indication that the concept is not part of the Judaic religion – Laurie might be able to help us with that, but you can never find a Messianic Jew when you need one – rather, it would seem to have been introduced by the Greeks.
Since this is an “Open Conversation,” I’m going to introduce a Kathy-free topic I stole from a friend (Hey, if you can’t steal from your friends, who CAN you steal from?):
Psychopaths aren’t evil, they simply have defective brains. Yet, while they are only 1% of the population, they are 20% of prison inmates. Worse, they account for 50% of violent crimes. Thus, one of the most productive things we could do to make society safer, would be to do something about psychopaths.
But what?
Since the physical cause of psychopathy was discovered, a puzzling fact became clear: Many psychopaths go through life without committing any major crime, much less a violent crime. In fact, the scientist who actually identified the area and condition of the brain causing psychopathy discovered, by accident, that he himself is a psychopath! So, even he, a scientist who has forwarded our understanding of psychopathy, is a psychopath. Anything we were to do to control psychopathy might, if handled improperly, prevent the good a psychopath can do.
Confused? Well, what are the symptoms of psychopathy? (Even if you don’t read them all, there is further discussion after the list of symptoms.):
1. GLIB AND SUPERFICIAL CHARM — the tendency to be smooth, engaging, charming, slick, and verbally facile. Psychopathic charm is not in the least shy, self-conscious, or afraid to say anything. A psychopath never gets tongue-tied. He can also be a great listener, to simulate empathy while zeroing in on his targets’ dreams and vulnerabilities, to be able to manipulate them better.
2. GRANDIOSE SELF-WORTH — a grossly inflated view of one’s abilities and self-worth, self-assured, opinionated, cocky, a braggart. Psychopaths are arrogant people who believe they are superior human beings.
3. NEED FOR STIMULATION or PRONENESS TO BOREDOM — an excessive need for novel, thrilling, and exciting stimulation; taking chances and doing things that are risky. Psychopaths often have a low self-discipline in carrying tasks through to completion because they get bored easily. They fail to work at the same job for any length of time, for example, or to finish tasks that they consider dull or routine.
4. PATHOLOGICAL LYING — can be moderate or high; in moderate form, they will be shrewd, crafty, cunning, sly, and clever; in extreme form, they will be deceptive, deceitful, underhanded, unscrupulous, manipulative and dishonest.
5. CONNING AND MANIPULATIVENESS: the use of deceit and deception to cheat, con, or defraud others for personal gain; distinguished from Item #4 in the degree to which exploitation and callous ruthlessness is present, as reflected in a lack of concern for the feelings and suffering of one’s victims.
6. LACK OF REMORSE OR GUILT: a lack of feelings or concern for the losses, pain, and suffering of victims; a tendency to be unconcerned, dispassionate, coldhearted and unempathic. This item is usually demonstrated by a disdain for one’s victims.
7. SHALLOW AFFECT: emotional poverty or a limited range or depth of feelings; interpersonal coldness in spite of signs of open gregariousness and superficial warmth.
8. CALLOUSNESS and LACK OF EMPATHY: a lack of feelings toward people in general; cold, contemptuous, inconsiderate, and tactless.
9. PARASITIC LIFESTYLE: an intentional, manipulative, selfish, and exploitative financial dependence on others as reflected in a lack of motivation, low self-discipline and the inability to carry through one’s responsibilities.
10. POOR BEHAVIORAL CONTROLS: expressions of irritability, annoyance, impatience, threats, aggression and verbal abuse; inadequate control of anger and temper; acting hastily.
11. PROMISCUOUS SEXUAL BEHAVIOR: a variety of brief, superficial relations, numerous affairs, and an indiscriminate selection of sexual partners; the maintenance of numerous, multiple relationships at the same time; a history of attempts to sexually coerce others into sexual activity (rape) or taking great pride at discussing sexual exploits and conquests.
12. EARLY BEHAVIOR PROBLEMS: a variety of behaviors prior to age 13, including lying, theft, cheating, vandalism, bullying, sexual activity, fire-setting, glue-sniffing, alcohol use and running away from home.
13. LACK OF REALISTIC, LONG-TERM GOALS: an inability or persistent failure to develop and execute long-term plans and goals; a nomadic existence, aimless, lacking direction in life.
14. IMPULSIVITY: the occurrence of behaviors that are unpremeditated and lack reflection or planning; inability to resist temptation, frustrations and momentary urges; a lack of deliberation without considering the consequences; foolhardy, rash, unpredictable, erratic and reckless.
15. IRRESPONSIBILITY: repeated failure to fulfill or honor obligations and commitments; such as not paying bills, defaulting on loans, performing sloppy work, being absent or late to work, failing to honor contractual agreements.
16. FAILURE TO ACCEPT RESPONSIBILITY FOR OWN ACTIONS: a failure to accept responsibility for one’s actions reflected in low conscientiousness, an absence of dutifulness, antagonistic manipulation, denial of responsibility, and an effort to manipulate others through this denial.
17. MANY SHORT-TERM RELATIONSHIPS: a lack of commitment to a long-term relationship reflected in inconsistent, undependable, and unreliable commitments in life, including in marital and familial bonds.
18. JUVENILE DELINQUENCY: behavior problems between the ages of 13-18; mostly behaviors that are crimes or clearly involve aspects of antagonism, exploitation, aggression, manipulation, or a callous, ruthless tough-mindedness.
19. REVOCATION OF CONDITION RELEASE: a revocation of probation or other conditional release due to technical violations, such as carelessness, low deliberation or failing to appear.
20. CRIMINAL VERSATILITY: a diversity of types of criminal offenses, regardless if the person has been arrested or convicted for them; taking great pride at getting away with crimes or wrongdoings.
Some of our most cherished ideas about psychopaths are flat out wrong. While bad parenting often results in violent, dysfunctional people, it is easy to find violent psychopathic monsters who were raised ideally in every way. Nurturing environment, loving parents, and yet one day they commit some horrific crime.
So, the question is this: now that we know and can identify the brain condition that IS psychopathy, what can or should we do to prevent that 50% of violent crimes which they cause.
Strangely, we often admire and appreciate psychopaths. Many of our leading politicians, athletes, and business leaders are psychopaths, as are people run charitable programs. Successful doctors are often psychopaths because they can set emotions aside and make starkly practical decisions.
There’s another question to be answered, and it’s primarily an ethical one. Since psychopathy is a dysfunction of the brain, to what extent can we hold psychopaths responsible for any crimes they may commit?
“If you actually wanted answers you could have found them here.”
I already have the answers, but most here disagree.. hence the need for
debate, so all can know the truth.. again, I don’t understand why this is
so hard to grasp.
“Yet when I tried to explain to her how these things she brought up had a natural explanation she said my answers weren’t good enough. ”
Did I give reasons WHY I said your answers weren’t good enough? I did. Did you respond to those reasons? You did not. Instead you make an unsupported accusation..
“Translation = your answers are not what I wanted to hear or was looking for.”
“Debate and dialogue can be helpful in finding truth, but connecting legitimate evidence tends to be far more effective. Like how it was discovered that the Earth revolves around the Sun. Oh right, Christianity wasn’t receptive to that truth either as it was at odds with Genesis.
Pretty sure in that case, debate actually prevented understanding of that truth. That tends to be a common trend with Christianity. Just like your hesitance to accept evolution without a full observation of it, which we now have.”
It’s important that the evidence is objectively processed.
Your example of “Christianity” not being receptive to the truth is a poor example.. where in the NT does is prove this about Christianity? And where is it “at odds” with Genesis about the Earth and the Sun?? That’s more of that false atheist/ liberal propaganda.
You’re talking about the Catholic Church I believe.. they don’t define Christianity. They did many things that were not in line with NT teachings.
Finding Truth 
“Who knows what topics will come up next?”
God only knows –
And He’s NOT tellin !
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“I ask questions and hope for answers.. silly me.” – translate that, “I ask questions and hope for answers, get them, but refuse to accept them because they don’t agree with what I want to hear.. silly me.” Indeed.
LikeLike
jasonshaw – thanks for the blast-from-the-past video! We always wondered what happened to Uncle Fred – he just went out one day for a pack of smokes, and we never saw him again. After 150 million years, we had almost given up hope.
LikeLike
KC, I’m half-way through God’s Debris. Fascinating! The old man makes some really good points. I would suggest that Kathy read it, but I’m afraid she wouldn’t understand the concept. What do you think?
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“Looked at any ink blots lately?”
A guy goes to a psychiatrist for an evaluation. The psychiatrist shows him a series of ink blot tests.
Psychiatrist: “What does this picture remind you of?”
Guy: “Sex!”
Psychiatrist: “And this one?”
Guy: “Sex!”
Psychiatrist:: “And THIS one?”
Guy: “Sex!”
Psychiatrist: “Sir, it seems to me that you are obsessed with sex.”
Guy: ME?! – YOU’RE the one with all the dirty pictures!
Sometimes we see what we want to see, and in some cases, refuse to accept that it could ever be otherwise.
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Arch,
Kathy admits that she knows little to nothing about electronics. Electronics has been my entire career in one form or another. Yet when I tried to explain to her how these things she brought up had a natural explanation she said my answers weren’t good enough. Translation = your answers are not what I wanted to hear or was looking for.
Most of the answers WE collectively have given to her fall into the same category . They are not what she wanted to hear or was looking for.
The funny part was when she said, ““Naturally, I wanted to believe that it was one or both of my parents. But, after talking to people more knowledgeable than me about Christianity and the Bible, I was told that it wasn’t them, but demonic spirits wanting to deceive me into believing it was them.”
Translation = I wanted to be one Supernatural Explanation but after talking to more knowledgeable Christians , I decided to believe in another Supernatural Explanation. 🙂
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I wanted to believe not be
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Can you believe we’re already at 80 comments? We’ll probably break 100 before the day’s over.
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Debate and dialogue can be helpful in finding truth, but connecting legitimate evidence tends to be far more effective. Like how it was discovered that the Earth revolves around the Sun. Oh right, Christianity wasn’t receptive to that truth either as it was at odds with Genesis.
Pretty sure in that case, debate actually prevented understanding of that truth. That tends to be a common trend with Christianity. Just like your hesitance to accept evolution without a full observation of it, which we now have.
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Great story Arch !
Nan, glad you are enjoying the read. I doubt that Kathy would entertain reading the book . The Old Man gives a great explanation of why people are religious and I think he is equally on track why skeptics are skeptics.
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Jason, you are right on track !
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Yes, I know KC – I’ve read everything so far on this latest entry. I tried a computer-free day, but withdrawal symptoms drew me back.
I wonder if Kathy can show me, in the OT, where demons are mentioned before 300 BCE. I ask, because that was the approximate date when Alexander the Great conquered the Levant. To the best of my knowledge, it was the influx of Greek culture that first introduced the Greek concept of daemons.
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Kathy,
Of course you have a point that the name of the blog indicates dialog is expected. We’ve all had this discussion multiple times, with multiple people over the years. What is the purpose, I wonder? If you think we should ask ourselves that very question, don’t worry. I am asking myself that right now.
If you actually wanted answers you could have found them here.
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“I wonder if Kathy can show me, in the OT, where demons are mentioned before 300 BCE.”
I can’t find where they are.
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Their absence before that time period would be a good indication that the concept is not part of the Judaic religion – Laurie might be able to help us with that, but you can never find a Messianic Jew when you need one – rather, it would seem to have been introduced by the Greeks.
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Arch, you read my book. Don’t you remember when the Big Bad Guy and his demons were born?
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Nan, that’s been a year ago, I’d have to dig it out and reread it.
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What?? No, it hasn’t been that long! Besides , you’d only need to read chapter 5. Or send me an email and I’ll refresh your memory.
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Since this is an “Open Conversation,” I’m going to introduce a Kathy-free topic I stole from a friend (Hey, if you can’t steal from your friends, who CAN you steal from?):
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Gliese,
“If you actually wanted answers you could have found them here.”
I already have the answers, but most here disagree.. hence the need for
debate, so all can know the truth.. again, I don’t understand why this is
so hard to grasp.
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kc,
“Yet when I tried to explain to her how these things she brought up had a natural explanation she said my answers weren’t good enough. ”
Did I give reasons WHY I said your answers weren’t good enough? I did. Did you respond to those reasons? You did not. Instead you make an unsupported accusation..
“Translation = your answers are not what I wanted to hear or was looking for.”
Sorry kc, this isn’t how it works.
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I’ve just realized that I, myself, possess an uncomfortable number of those characteristics!
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“I already have the answers, but most here disagree.. hence the need for debate, so all can know the truth..”
What could possibly convince a middle-aged (if you live to be 100!) high school dropout that they possess THE TRUTH?
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Jason,
“Debate and dialogue can be helpful in finding truth, but connecting legitimate evidence tends to be far more effective. Like how it was discovered that the Earth revolves around the Sun. Oh right, Christianity wasn’t receptive to that truth either as it was at odds with Genesis.
Pretty sure in that case, debate actually prevented understanding of that truth. That tends to be a common trend with Christianity. Just like your hesitance to accept evolution without a full observation of it, which we now have.”
It’s important that the evidence is objectively processed.
Your example of “Christianity” not being receptive to the truth is a poor example.. where in the NT does is prove this about Christianity? And where is it “at odds” with Genesis about the Earth and the Sun?? That’s more of that false atheist/ liberal propaganda.
You’re talking about the Catholic Church I believe.. they don’t define Christianity. They did many things that were not in line with NT teachings.
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“Or send me an email and I’ll refresh your memory.” – translation: “I’ve tossed your email address, arch!”
I’ll send it in the am Nan, I’m weary.
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