Agnosticism, Atheism, Bible Study, Christianity, Faith, God, Morality, Religion, Truth

Letter to Kathy (the Bible Has Problems)

Dear Kathy,

Since you graciously agreed (in our recent conversation) to let me present you with some examples of the Bible’s problems, I decided to do it in this way so it would have its own comment thread. As I’ve said, when I was a Christian, one strike against the Bible was not enough to shake my faith — maybe it only seemed problematic, maybe there was an explanation we hadn’t uncovered yet, maybe the historical accounts were wrong, etc. But as the problems began to mount up, I reached a point where I could no longer deny the fact that the Bible had actual errors.

A couple of suggestions before we begin. Try to be as open-minded about this as possible. As you go through these examples, ask yourself if God would allow such problems to exist in a message that he wanted all people to accept and believe? According to the Bible, whenever God sent someone a message, whether it was Pharaoh or Gideon or Nebuchadnezzar or Paul, they had no question whom it was from. They didn’t always follow it, as we see with people like Pharaoh and Solomon, but they didn’t question the source of the message or what it stated. So why would God operate differently today? Why would he want us to be so confused about his message that we’re able to question whether or not it’s really from him?

Another thing to keep in mind is that even if you come to the conclusion that the Bible has actual problems, that doesn’t mean you have to stop believing in God. There are a number of Christians who don’t believe in inerrancy. And even if you lose faith in the Christian god, that still doesn’t mean you have to stop believing in God. A number of people, including several of our founding fathers, were deists. I have a lot of sympathy for that view and plan to do a post on it soon.

Some of the items listed here will have links that provide additional information, especially when the issue is too detailed to list here. I hope that you’ll check out those links, since some of them are quite significant points. And regardless of how this article strikes you, I hope it will help serve as a great springboard to launch you into your own research.

Some of the Problems

Creation
The creation accounts in Genesis do not match what we’ve learned through science. This isn’t shocking news, but it bears looking into. Evolution and the Big Bang Theory had nothing to do with my deconversion, but I’ve learned more about both since leaving Christianity. It’s shocking how much misinformation I had been operating under. Not to say that all Christians are that way — that was simply my experience. But the evidence for both evolution and the Big Bang are far more substantial than I had ever realized. Two good resources for learning more about these issues are the following (though I’d also recommend checking out the recent Cosmos series, as well as some of the PBS NOVA specials):

Marco’s Daddy and the Beginning of Life on Earth


http://talkorigins.org/

Another problem with the creation accounts is that Genesis 1 says that plants and trees were made on the 3rd day, while man was made on the 6th. But Genesis 2:5-9 says that man was created before there were any plants or trees in the land. Also, the 1st chapter says that man was created after all the animals, but the 2nd chapter implies that it was the other way around. It seems strange that such discrepancies would exist only a chapter apart, but there are a number of textual clues that suggest the first 5 books of the Bible were assembled over a long period of time from various writings written by a number of different people. Many scholars believe that Genesis 1 and 2 represent two separate versions of the creation story that were both included because the compilers didn’t know which was more accurate. Whatever the reason, there’s no question that the differences exist and are hard to explain.

10 Plagues
During the 10 plagues, God afflicts all of Egypt’s livestock with a disease (Ex 9:1-7), and it specifies that it would affect the “horses, the donkeys, the camels, the herds, and the flocks.” We’re told that all of Egypt’s livestock died. But the later plague of boils was said to affect both man and beast (verse 10 of chapter 9). Maybe it meant non-livestock animals. But Ex 11:5 says that the death of the firstborn would also affect Egypt’s cattle, and in Exodus 14, Pharaoh pursues the Israelites with horses.

Hares Chew the Cud
Leviticus 11:6 tells us that hares chew the cud. They do not. Animals that chew the cud are called ruminants. When they eat plant matter, it goes to their first stomach to soften, and then it’s regurgitated to their mouth. They spend time re-chewing it, and then it is swallowed and fully digested. Ruminants (cows, sheep, goats, etc.) are recognizable because their chewing of the cud is very obvious. Hares (rabbits) don’t chew the cud; however, their mouths do move frequently, so it’s possible to see why some people may have assumed that they do chew the cud. Of course, God would know they didn’t, and this is why the passage is problematic. You can read more about this here.

Arphaxad
In the genealogy given in Genesis 11:10-12, we see that Noah fathered Shem and Shem fathered Arphaxad. At the age of 35, Arphaxad fathered Shelah. This information is confirmed in 1 Chron 1:18. But Luke 3:35-36 tells us that Arphaxad’s son was Cainan, and he was the father of Shelah.

Where does Luke get this information? It disagrees with the Old Testament, so who should we believe? Some have suggested that Genesis and 1 Chronicles simply left out Cainan for some reason. But why would they do that? To further complicate it, how could Cainan have fit in there? Genesis tells us that Arphaxad was 35 when he fathered Shelah. Does it really seem likely that Arphaxad became a grandfather by 35, especially when you consider the extreme old ages that people lived to at that time?

Another explanation is that some copyist messed up when copying Luke and Cainan is just a mistake. But this is not much better. First of all, the error would have needed to occur early for it to be in all our copies of Luke. Secondly, are we really comfortable saying that we have the inspired word of our creator, but it got messed up by some guy who wasn’t paying close attention? To me, that doesn’t lend a lot of credence to the idea of inspiration or inerrancy.

Instead, the most likely explanation is that Luke made a mistake. This, of course, would indicate that he was not inspired.

Problems in the Book of Daniel
In Daniel 5, the writer refers to Belshazzar as the son of Nebuchadnezzar 7 different times. Yet we know from multiple contemporary sources that Belshazzar’s father was Nabonidus, who was not related to Nebuchadnezzar. The same chapter says that Darius the Mede took over Babylon, but this person does not seem to have ever existed. Daniel says that he was the son of Ahaseurus, and in mentioning this, the author of Daniel indicates that he was thinking of a later ruler — the persian emperor Darius the Great, whose son was Ahaseurus. This post in particular goes into the problems surrounding the 5th chapter, but if you’d like to learn about the problems in the rest of the book, you can access each article in the series here.

Jairus’s Daughter
In Mark 5:23, Jairus finds Jesus and says that his daughter is at the point of death. While they’re on their way to the house, some of his servants find them on the way and say that she has died and there’s no point in troubling Jesus further.

However, in Matthew 9:18, Jairus already knows that his daughter has died, but tells Jesus that if he’ll lay his hands on her, she’ll live. This may seem like a minor difference, but honestly, there’s only one scenario that could be true. Either the girl was already dead, or she wasn’t. And if Jairus already knew she was dead, then there was no point in his servants coming to tell him that (so of course, they don’t appear in Matthew’s account).

The Centurion
This is similar to the previous issue. Matthew and Luke both record a centurion who asks Jesus to heal his sick servant. Matthew 8:5-13 says that the centurion himself comes before Jesus to ask for help. Luke 7:1-10 says that the Jewish elders went on his behalf, and then he sent servants to follow up. In Luke, Jesus never speaks to, or even sees, the centurion at all.

Hight Priest
In Mark 2:23-28, Jesus talks about the occasion from the Old Testament when David ate the showbread, which Jesus said was in the days of Abiathar the high priest. However, in 1 Samuel 21:1-6, it appears that Ahimelech was the high priest. Some have tried to answer this problem by saying that Abiathar was alive during that particular episode, so Jesus’ statement is still true. But that’s obviously not the intent of the passage. After all, we would correct anyone who said that the tragedy of 9/11 occurred during the days of President Barack Obama. He may have been alive at the time, but that event did not happen while he was President.

430 Years
Galatians 3:16-17 says this:

The promises were spoken to Abraham and to his seed. The Scripture does not say “and to seeds,” meaning many people, but “and to your seed,” meaning one person, who is Christ. What I mean is this: The law, introduced 430 years later, does not set aside the covenant previously established by God and thus do away with the promise.

Here, Paul says that the law came 430 years after the promises were made to Abraham. But in Exodus 12:40-41, we see:

Now the length of time the Israelite people lived in Egypt was 430 years. At the end of the 430 years, to the very day, all the LORD’s divisions left Egypt.

If the Israelites were in Egypt 430 years, then there could not have been 430 years between Abraham’s promises and the law. God made the promises to Abraham in Genesis 12:1-3, and as we read on through Genesis, we see that Abraham had no children at this time. Later, he had a son named Isaac. When Isaac was 60 years old, he had Jacob (Gen 25:24-26), and Jacob had 12 sons that produced the 12 tribes of Israel. Already, we can see that some time has passed since Abraham received the promise. Once Jacob’s sons were all grown with families of their own, they finally settled in Egypt. Jacob was 130 years old at this time (Gen 47:9), and this marks the beginning of that 430 year period that the Israelites spent in Egypt.

That means that the time between the promise to Abraham and the giving of the law was actually over 600 years. So why did Paul say 430 years? I think it’s obvious that this was a simple mistake. He remembered the 430 year figure because that’s how much time the Israelites spent in Egypt, and so he simply misspoke. It’s not a big deal… except that he’s supposed to be inspired by God.

Jesus’ Birth
There are a number of issues surrounding Jesus’ birth. First, Matthew’s and Luke’s accounts contradict one another on virtually all the details, which you can read about here. Secondly, Matthew seems to invent an episode where Herod kills all the children in Bethlehem who are 2 and under, causing Mary, Joseph, and Jesus to flee to Egypt (instead of just returning home to Nazareth, because only Luke says that they started in Nazareth). Matthew does this in order to “fulfill” some Old Testament passages that actually have nothing to do with Jesus or killing babies. You can read about Matthew’s misuse of the Old Testament here — it’s quite blatant.

The Virgin Birth is one of the most famous aspects of Jesus’ story, and it was supposedly done in fulfillment of a prophecy from Isaiah. But it turns out that Isaiah was prophesying no such thing — he was talking about an event that was happening in his own time, and Matthew (once again) just appropriated the “prophecy” for his own devices. You can read all the details here.

Another problem concerning Jesus’ birth narratives is that Matthew and Luke both offer genealogies for Jesus, but they are completely different from one another. Worse, they don’t match the genealogies listed in the Old Testament, either. And Matthew claims that there was a pattern in the number of generations between Abraham and David, between David and the Babylonian captivity, and between the Babylonian captivity and Christ. But to get this neat division, he is forced to leave out some names. In other words, that pattern didn’t happen. You can read more about that here.

The Triumphal Entry
While not as blatant as most of these other issues, when Matthew recounts Jesus’ triumphal entry into Jerusalem, he once again borrows from the Old Testament, but seems to make a mistake in his implementation. See here for more info.

Judas’ Death
Judas is well known for being the disciple that betrayed Jesus, but what’s not as well known is there are two different accounts of his death, and it’s very hard to reconcile them. According to Matthew, Judas threw his money down at the chief priests’ feet and went out and hanged himself. We’re not told where he did this. The priests then take the money, and instead of putting it back in the treasury (since it’s blood money), they buy a field to use for burying strangers. Because they bought the field with this money, it’s called the “Field of Blood.”

According to Acts, Judas bought a field with his money (we’re not told that he was remorseful), and he somehow fell down, bursting open in the middle and bleeding to death. The field was called “Field of Blood” after that because of the manner in which Judas died.

To make things more complicated, Matthew (of course) says that this happened in accordance with Jeremiah’s prophecy, but there’s nothing in Jeremiah that matches up. The closest reference comes from Zechariah, not Jeremiah.

These issues really complicate the notion of divine inspiration, and you can read more about them here.

The Crucifixion
There are several big problems with the way the gospels record the events of Jesus’ death, including the fact that different times of day are given for it, and even different days altogether. You can read more about this here.

The Resurrection
There are also a number of problems concerning the resurrection, some minor, some major. They’re too involved to get into here, but you can read all about them here and here.

The Problem of Hell
The notion of Hell is fraught with problems. It might even surprise you to learn that the Bible’s teachings on the afterlife change dramatically between the Old and New Testaments. I go into detail about Hell’s problems here, here, and here.

The Problem of Evil
Another huge problem for Christianity is the problem of evil, which I talk about here. This post also addresses the “problem of Heaven.”

The Bible’s Morality
While a number of people believe that the Christian god is the source of all morality, the Bible is actually filled with some monstrous acts that are either commanded by God, done with his consent, or carried out by him directly. I talk about some specific examples here, and I address some of the common responses to them here.

Conclusion

Kathy, there are a number of other examples that could be given, including the prophecy of Tyre that we’ve been discussing. But to me, these are some of the most significant and clear-cut problems. We could try to manufacture explanations for every one of these — some might be more believable than others. But why should we have to? If a perfect God inspired this book, why should it contain so many discrepancies? And honestly, some of these issues can’t be explained. They’re just wrong. The problems go well beyond internal contradictions and unfulfilled prophecies. There are problems of authorship, problems with the doctrines, and problems with the way the texts were written, transcribed, and compiled.

I’m sure you’ve spent your time as a Christian trying to reach those who are lost. You’ve always believed that Christianity is truth, and it’s the one thing that everyone needs. But could it be that Christianity is just as false as every other religion in the world? And if that’s the case, wouldn’t you want to leave it behind? When one is dedicated to finding truth, they have to be prepared to follow it wherever it leads. It’s not always easy or popular. It’s not even a guarantee that you’re right. All it means is that you follow the evidence where it leads to the best of your ability. If you find out that you’re wrong about something, you adjust course when the evidence dictates. If God exists, and if he’s righteous, what more could he ask for than that? I’ll close with my favorite quote:

Live a good life. If there are gods and they are just, then they will not care how devout you have been, but will welcome you based on the virtues you have lived by. If there are gods, but unjust, then you should not want to worship them. If there are no gods, then you will be gone, but will have lived a noble life that will live on in the memories of your loved ones.
— Marcus Aurelius

1,782 thoughts on “Letter to Kathy (the Bible Has Problems)”

  1. “Nor should they be. Ruth has demonstrated a total lack of basic Christianity. You might as well beg that a “lawyer” is telling the truth about their profession when they don’t understand anything about jurisprudence.”

    Of course Ruth has demonstrated a lack of christianity, as she is not claiming to be christian, but rather claims to be an nonbeliever. She claims to have once been a christian who no longer is one.

    basic christianity is believing that the man jesus was god’s literal son, who died on a cross to redeem us all, rose from the dead and flew into heaven, and that you’re them motivated by that belief to love the lord your god with all your heart mind and soul, and then to love your neighbor as yourself. That’s the basics as the bible lays out. sadly, many proclaimed christians haven’t figured the love part out either.

    I was once a star soccer player, but dont look or act like one now.

    Like

  2. You might want to educate your fellow Christians that going around telling people that believing that Jesus died for your sins is enough for salvation. They need to know all your caveats for true belief.

    Like

  3. Yes, God is perfect.. but look at us.. His creation is NOT perfect

    An all-powerful, all-knowing, all-perfect being wouldn’t create imperfect beings. That—in the words of Spock—would be highly illogical.

    In fact, it wouldn’t create anything at all, because by its very definition the word “perfect” means to be complete, i.e:

    – lacking in no essential detail
    – entirely without flaws, defects, or shortcomings
    – conforming absolutely to the description or definition of an ideal type
    – excellent or complete beyond practical or theoretical improvement.
    – as good as it is possible to be.

    In other words, a perfect being would be a self-fulfilled being without needs, wants or desires.

    However, the god of the Bible has fits of rage, anger, hatred, jealousy, vengefulness, grief and remorse—hardly the traits of a perfect and complete being, let alone one that’s also all-knowing.

    Hence, the Christian conception of God is severely and irredeemably flawed.

    Like

  4. “No, it is not impossible. But then the question would be.. WHY would they make up the story and add details that were true? What in the world is the motive for this elaborate hoax Nate?? I’m sure you have an answer.. I’m curious as to what it is..” – kathy

    I dont think they were planning hoax. I think they really thought jesus was the messiah, but were confused when he died. They were trying to make sense of everything and started saying, “well, you know, maybe when he said this, he was getting at that…” and “maybe this passage in the OT about this, was really talking about jesus…” and the story grew and grew like and legend or game of telephone.

    But since we’re playing “why?” why would a prefect god write a book that left so many of these questions? I get that you dont have any questions, i dont understand why, but i see that you dont despite my understanding.

    I see questionable things that would not be in question had the been written a little clearer. Like, as one example, the day of dead, john says it’s prior to passover and mark days it’s during. that looks like a contradiction, and that should be easy to see why i see it that way.

    Or as another example, when jesus says that a seed must die before it will grow… this is just false. And it should also be easy to understand why I see this as an error.

    You may find plausible excuses or explanations to these and the others, but i have not seen any. again, the explanations I hear sound like hand waving that mike and blacksman talk about, they seem like the sort of explanations that could “rectify” any contradiction – and i dont find those compelling.

    You said earlier that there was factual evidence. please present it.

    and you keep talking about making a choice… do you choose to believe the sky is blue, or does the overwhelming evidence of a blue sky convict you of that? is it a choice or a conviction?

    For me, the I am convicted by the evidence to believe that the bible is only a product of man. But for you, is that you really just choose to believe it? I dont quite understand this point in regard to “choosing” that you keep making.

    If we all knew god was real, we would then choose whether or not to worship him, that would be a real choice, but belief isnt a choice is an eventuality, a conclusion – basic cause and effect.

    but again, two main points of mine:

    1) if you have this factual evidence, then please provide some (mika and blacksman dont like hand waving).

    2) if you cant even understand why some people see differing days of death (and other things like it) as a contradiction, then maybe there’s nothing left to talk about.

    Like

  5. “I don’t think any of you, not Kathy, not Mike, not whoever TBlacksman is in any position to judge who is and who isn’t a Christian.”

    and we know that given your lack of understanding you are not qualified to appoint or deny levels of qualifications for being a Christian. Seriously ridiculous – like you an atheist gets a vote as to how Christianity is defined.

    “You might want to educate your fellow Christians that going around telling people that believing that Jesus died for your sins is enough for salvation. They need to know all your caveats for true belief.”

    You might want to educate yourself that the need people have for Jesus to die for their sins is related to the fall and sin nature which you have PROVEN beyond a shadow of a doubt you do not and never have understood. Its not possible to understand the cross and not understand the problem it solves and why it was needed.

    You prove almost in every post that you have no understanding of Christianity. Unless you had a bout of amnesia there is no doubt about it. You were NEVER a real christian. You might as well demand you are a lawyer without ever having the knowledge to pass the bar.

    Like

  6. BTW Ruth, Mike Anthony is using TBlacksman as his new name.

    TBlacksman says, ” Sorry Nate, Mike Here
    its not going to go that way. If you are straightforward and honest and say that you have banned me for disagreeing with you and/or whatever else you wish to claim then fine. I’ll honor that in a heart beat.

    Nate says, “You’re not being moderated, Mike, so get over yourself. When you write a comment with so many links, WordPress thinks its spam and flags you automatically. Once I saw that I approved it — before I even saw your paranoid follow-up comment.”

    Mike must have gotten confused and thought he was on a Christian blogsite. They are the only ones I know who exercise permanent moderation or banning for the silliest of reasons. 🙂

    Like

  7. @blacksman

    you cited this verse earlier as a prophecy for (or linked to) the gaza strip:

    Isaiah 11:14New International Version (NIV)

    14 They will swoop down on the slopes of Philistia to the west;
    together they will plunder the people to the east.
    They will subdue Edom and Moab,
    and the Ammonites will be subject to them.

    yeah, this looks as clear as a nostradomis prophecy. This is good evidence in your mind? I couldnt quite tell how you meant it when you posted it.

    Like

  8. “Seriously ridiculous – like you an atheist gets a vote as to how Christianity is defined.” blacksman

    the bible defines it, you not you either smart guy. You and mike clearly fall outside of that definition. Not worry though, you’re with plenty of your brethren.

    Like

  9. “1) if you have this factual evidence, then please provide some (mika and blacksman dont like hand waving).”

    Scroll up Both Kathy and I left links last night. Get busy because that rhetoric won’t work any longer. My bet is you are about to do so much handwaving to the evidence that your hands might need to be surgically re attached. I haven’t even put up half of what I got.

    Like

  10. “yeah, this looks as clear as a nostradomis prophecy. This is good evidence in your mind? I couldnt quite tell how you meant it when you posted it.”

    LOL skipped over the other ones eh poor Will. too much Maths? Can’t find city walls surrounding any cities in Israel? Let the HAND WAVING BEGIN!! its going be epic baby. 🙂 🙂

    and yeah if you look on a map you might get a clue OF course we both know you didn’t look at one. Google to the rescue!

    Like

  11. “Yes, God is perfect.. but look at us.. His creation is NOT perfect.. and there is no scripture
    that suggests the Bible is supposed to be without technical errors… especially when there are accounts written by His imperfect creation.”

    so you’re saying that you’d believe the bible could have errors, if the bible itself had a scripture that read, “this bible may contain errors?”

    2 tim 3:16 coems pretty close. it says “ALL” scripture is inspired by god and is…. yada, yada, yada…

    there’s that word “all” you’re always looking for. so yes, any small part that is not legit, means this book is not perfect.

    Like

  12. “the bible defines it, you not you either smart guy. You and mike clearly fall outside of that definition. ”

    Another Atheist attempts to define Christianity and who is or who would be one. Will the democrats be picking the republican Nominee this year? 🙂

    Like

  13. “LOL skipped over the other ones eh poor Will. too much Maths? Can’t find city walls surrounding any cities in Israel? Let the HAND WAVING BEGIN!! its going be epic baby. ”

    just havent gotten to them yet. but if they’re such stellar examples, then why include the Isaiah 11:14 gem?

    as far as map reading, you’re the one who looks at a current satellite picture of tyre and sees a bare rock, so forgive me for not being unmoved your lackluster assertions.

    Like

  14. “there’s that word “all” you’re always looking for. so yes, any small part that is not legit, means this book is not perfect.”

    Kathy has already clarified she finds no contradiction in the Bible whatsoever. Your reading skills are even worst than usual

    To wit. – I AM Mike.

    Like

  15. “just havent gotten to them yet. but if they’re such stellar examples, then why include the Isaiah 11:14 gem?”

    Because its great, detailed and obvious. the fact that you don’t accept it or any of the evidence will not matter squat to me. What it will do is cause me to laugh at you every time you claim no evidence has been presented. Why? because if your acceptance of a fact is needed to count as evidence then you have none either because I don’t accept yours on anything.

    Like

  16. “Kathy has already clarified she finds no contradiction in the Bible whatsoever. Your reading skills are even worst than usual” – mike (blacksman)

    well, one of our reading skill is…

    Yes, she has clarified this, while I have clarified that there are contradictions – but regardless, she said that the were no scripture saying that errors couldnt be there… seemed like a silly, if not stupid thing to say, but it reminded me of 2 Tim : 16, so I shared and explained that this verse does sort of say that there should be no errors…

    oh, this is embarrassing, you were criticizing me for having poor reading skills, when it turns out, you hadent read very carefully before posting…

    but reading skill have little to do with the discussion at hand.

    Do you want to help kathy out by providing your factual evidence… (hint – Isaiah 11:14 isnt a good example).

    Like

  17. “as far as map reading, you’re the one who looks at a current satellite picture of tyre and sees a bare rock”

    ROFL nope I am the one that looks at Google maps and Sees Google clear as day mark a bare spot on their map as TYRE RUINS . Where your glasses at Will? 🙂

    Like

  18. …”Because its great, detailed and obvious.” – mike

    really? you’re really saying that:

    Isaiah 11:14New International Version (NIV)

    14 They will swoop down on the slopes of Philistia to the west;
    together they will plunder the people to the east.
    They will subdue Edom and Moab,
    and the Ammonites will be subject to them.

    is detailed and obvious?

    of what, exactly?

    Like

  19. @KC,

    Thanks for the heads up. I just popped over and read that on Nate’s latest post.

    @Mike,

    I wasn’t defining Christianity. I was using your definition since you seem to think your the arbiter of it.

    Like

  20. “Do you want to help kathy out by providing your factual evidence… (hint – Isaiah 11:14 isnt a good example).”

    Hint 🙂 Your ignorance of what the shoulders of the phillistines CLEARLY means will not serve as rebuttal. Get busy. Put on your big boy pants and put some tape around your wrists before your hands fall off.

    YOU have been claiming the Christians fudge to get out of contradictions? Sorry my ladde Your turn up at bat. lets see how much fudging you do to get OUT of fulfilled or fulfilling prophecies.

    Like

  21. “I wasn’t defining Christianity. I was using your definition since you seem to think your the arbiter of it.”

    Read the book and you might make a point but yeah any Christian who actually knows what a sin nature is is better qualified than you are. its a good thing though Ruth. Maybe you can inform yourself better and some light bulbs may start going off.

    Keep reading this thread as well the light bulb may start going off as you see Nate and William scurry around trying to fudge out of some real and obviously fulfilled prophecies.

    Like

  22. “ROFL nope I am the one that looks at Google maps and Sees Google clear as day mark a bare spot on their map as TYRE RUINS . Where your glasses at Will?”

    you’re an idiot. The “tyre ruins” dont represent and dont claim to represent the entire city as it is today or as it was in ancient time. it’s merely letting you know where the existing ruins are – are you really serious? if you put on your reading glasses, you’ll see that the whole city is named tyre and if you put your thinking cap on, you’ll realize that “the ruins of tyre” section isnt the entire confines or limits of the original city either.

    anyone else out there? just look at a satellite image of tyre and decide for yourself whether there’s a city there or just bare rocks.

    if you go to google maps you can also find ruins of Rome, but that doesnt mean there isnt a modern rome.

    but again, the two main points of mine (tyre is another topic from another post):

    1) if you have this factual evidence, then please provide some.

    2) if you cant even understand why some people see differing days of death (and other things like it) as a contradiction, then maybe there’s nothing left to talk about.

    Like

  23. ” They are the only ones I know who exercise permanent moderation or banning for the silliest of reasons. :-)”

    IN that case KK Nate s one confused fellow :). He must have flip flopped back to Christianity because he banned me a couple months back

    Like

  24. “Hint 🙂 Your ignorance of what the shoulders of the phillistines CLEARLY means will not serve as rebuttal. Get busy. Put on your big boy pants and put some tape around your wrists before your hands fall off.” – Mike T Blacksman

    ah, yes, the ole, “if you dont know I’m not gonna tell you…” dodge.

    is that what you meant by hand waving?

    Like

Comments are closed.